Sprinter Seat Upgrade

Our new seats raised to normal sitting height when turned.

Note: This write-up is mostly about Class C Sprinter vans but I've included enough information for those with B conversions to solve the issues they have with seats also as I have owned both. I have a Solera but as far as I know, all the Class C's have the same problems.

Sprinter vans come with seats that are at best tolerable. Even the seats Mercedes calls "luxury" are far from it. We have had two Sprinters, a van ordered new with what Mercedes calls "luxury seats", that I converted to a camper and now, a Solera Class C by Forest River.  The Solera came with the basic seat. If you have air bags in your seats, you cannot change them unless you reprogram the computer and it's unlikely you'll find any dealer willing to do it because of liability fears.

My wife has severe spinal problems and sitting in most seats is only tolerated for a few hours without laying down. That is why virtually all our traveling is done in an RV - the bed is a must at frequent rest stops. When we bought the Solera, we fully intended to get suspension seats. It turned out, there are only a few suspension seats that fit a Sprinter and when I first started looking, found none that worked with a swivel, including the Mercedes suspension seats. Panic set in! We had to have better seats and desparately wanted them to go up the 5" or so needed to be useful when swiveled toward the back. The search began.........

Quick Summary

What we got:  Knoedler Extreme Lowriders with 1" memory foam added. Purchased from Seat Specialists online.

Pros:  Excellent quality (construction, stitching, materials) and real comfort - a combination of adjustability of the back and wings and the air suspension. It's amazing what the air ride does to the big hard bumps. Instead of getting jarred, the seat goes down softly and gently back up. I now know why so many long haul truckers use them. Maybe even more important, you can easily raise them to the right height when swiveled so the front seats are truly usable as part of the living area. And, after driving all day they're still comfortable all evening.

Cons: Expensive and heavy. A pair of them including adapters will add about a hundred pounds to your front axle and lighten your wallet by close to $4K depending on options chosen. Note: the adapter for aftermarket swivels would be at least 10# less each seat as it is simply a flat plate.

The Details

When I first contacted Seat Specialists, an online truck seat dealer, they were marketing a seat for the Sprinter but said it would not work with a swivel. I still had my van at the time (in addition to the Solera) and couldn't understand why not as the top of my van swivels (aftermarket) were identical to the base. Turns out the Mercedes swivel is totally different - I hadn't even looked at it before as I presumed it would be like the aftermarket units. It has the release mechanism on top instead of between the bottom and top plate. The only problem with mounting any air suspension seats on a swivel is the height will be intolerable for most of us and when swiveled toward the rear in a van conversion, would be even worse since the rear floor is about 3" lower than the front. Read on down for the solution to this if you have a van rather than a class C and would like seats any height you want no matter wheather facing front or back.

Possibly as a result of my incessant whining, Knoedler, the manufacturer of the seat, developed an adapter plate specifically for the Mercedes swivel - I have the first one they made. Anyone buying now will get a similar model but with the changes I suggested. They were great to work with through my contact, Jen, at Seat Specialists. I got to know them all quite well as the process took several months with very frequent emails between Jen and me.

Whereas an aftermarket swivel is typically 1.5 - 2" thick, the Mercedes swivel is 4" thick and by mounting it on a short box, the seat height ends up the same as a standard seat+box. If you have aftermarket swivels with the release between the plates, all you need is a 1/4" thick adaptor plate, but with the Mercedes swivel, the adapter has to accommodate the release lever so it's much more involved, heavier and more expensive.

Seats swiveled at same height as for driving - too low for comfort unless you're a 4 year old kid.

With just the drivers seat elevated to normal sitting height to show the difference.

With both seats raised to the proper height for sitting. Looking up above the seats, you can see the LED reading lights I installed (purchased on EBay 3 for $55 - the 3rd one went into the dinette). Power for the lights came from the TV antenna amp, then down to the molding around the edge of the bunk and under the molding (removed during install). Easy to do, looks good and provides excellent light for reading in our new seats.

The controls - there are 2 for the back (mid and lower), and one for the wings in addition to height control.

The base and why it's so heavy. Lots of steel, an air bag and a shock that give height adjustment and that cushy ride.

Options

There are 5 upholstery options with plenty of color choice. The only one that is significantly more money is the leather. We chose the synthetic leather and it's very nice looking material. We also have the 1" memory foam but did not add heat, massage or anything else.

There's an Isolator option to control "backslap", something semi-trucks experience - Sprinters don't need it.
Stroke is the difference between the lowest and highest level it will go. For a class C, you need the 5.5" option unless you're really tall. For a van using an aftermarket swivel and a short box, a 4" stroke is probably adequate but if in doubt it's little more for the 5.5" stroke.

Compressor:  On the Sprinter specific page on the website, the built in compressor is spec'd as standard. They sell the exact same seat to truckers but the compressor is an option (just search "extreme lowrider" on their website) since most large trucks have on board air. The difference in price is just the compressor. Buying one seat, the built in compressor makes sense, but if you order two, it makes sense to seriously consider adding on board air and ordering the seats without compressors. It's cheaper (not counting installation) and it gets the compressor out of the cab, plus you have all the benefits of on board air. I have a Viair continuous duty compressor with a 2.5 gallon air tank under the chassis. It hardly ever comes on and it's barely audible inside anyway.

http://www.amazon.com/Viair-45040-450C-Air-Compressor/dp/B000FQ78VI/ref=sr_1_6?ie=UTF8&qid=1425829802&sr=8-6&keywords=viair+compressor

http://viaircorp.com/2_5gallon.html

With an external compressor, the install is a maybe a tiny bit more complicated because you have to make sure the pressure tubing will swivel with the seat, but otherwise running the air line is just as easy as running wires. Of course you also have the install of the compressor/tank etc.

Installation

 Most of the install is very straight forward and few tools are required. These seats are heavy as mentioned and awkward. Help getting them in and on the base is important in order to avoid back strain and scratches to surrounding surfaces. Before putting them in place, you need to have wires (if built-in compressor) or air line (1/4" airbrake line easily ordered on line) in place coming through the base. The main issue if using external air is routing the air line so that it's safe when swiveling the seats. I drilled a hole very near the air bag to get it as central as possible and forced a piece of 1/2" PEX pipe thru it - I then flaired both ends with a heat gun and had a nice bushing at no cost. I was told the new ones, after my feedback would have a hole for feeding wire or airline through the base.

It's easy to get either air or wire into the cab as there's an opening at the base of the step-up between the cab and living area where a lot of wires pass from the cab to points elsewhere. I just put a T on after getting the line into the cab and ran a line through holes already present at the base of each seat box. To make sure there was no stress on the tubing when swiveling, for each seat, I took a piece of air line and warmed it a bit with a heat gun to relax the moleculer bonds, then made a couple loops toward one end. Once cool, it held the shape and I used that as the piece going from the T through the base to the input on the seat. It seemed to work well but I'm sure there are far more elegant ways to do it.

The seat base is bolted to the adapter first and then set in place and bolted to the top of the swivel. You do need new longer bolts to attach it to the base. I've forgotten the size so measure the length needed carefully and take one of the old bolts in (they're metric of course) and be sure to get class 8 or better.

The bottom line

There are good reasons to do this, comfort while driving and when camped of course, but just as important is the height adjustment making the seats actually usable when swiveled. The comfort driving is like night and day and now the seats that swiveled but were useless, are now really part of the living area. My wife who has disabling pain of both the lower back and neck can now ride in the comfort of a nice recliner, and when we stop, still has that recliner to sit rather than having to lay down.

We recently drove almost 7 hours in a day (not planned) on a very rough freeway and she tolerated it better than 2 hours of driving in our previous van, which had better seats than the Solera. To me it was worth every penny, but the cost and weight are substantial and it's certainly not for everyone.

I thought a lot about the cost, as it is a lot. But considering the huge increase in comfort and function for a fairly small fraction of the cost of the motorhome, I consider it a real bargain. I can't think of anything else I could have added for the value per dollar

If you do decide to get these seats

When I first wrote about these seats, I mentioned a discount code and then found out they no longer did that. Since then I contacted Jen at Seat Specialists and she told me they would set up a $50 discount just for people coming from this write-up. You can get it by putting "ExtremelowriderReferral" in at checkout or just tell Jen that Joe sent you. She and I communicated a lot while working through the new adapter plates and I only have good things to say about her.

My excellent experience working with Jen and Knoedler is a big part of the reason for writing such an extensive review. They did a lot of extra effort to help me out not knowing if they would sell enough to others to cover development costs. I really appreciate that. That, and I would have loved to have some guidance when I was looking for seats. I hope this helps those who are unhappy with the stock seats for any reason, but especially so if health issues are limiting the use of their motorhome.

For seats with a built in compressor, go here.
If you want seats without the built-in compressor, go here.

Addendum

Now that we have basically high end recliners in the living room, the 12 volt Jensen TV was moved from the bunk area to my son's sailboat. I bought a very thin 32" Vizio (only 2" thick) and after moving the mirror to the bathroom door, mounted the TV on (actually set into) the wall. BIG improvement in both appearance and function.

 

 

It's a 110 volt TV but that won't be a problem as I have on my workbench a 400 amp hr lithium house battery and 2000 watt inverter that will be installed soon to go with the 300 watts of solar already in place. The book rack is nice but also functional as the TV is set into the wall and needs ventilation. The top of the book rack is open and there's a gap at the top of the TV for airflow. The trim on the left of the slide was pulled off and moved over against the dinette back giving clearance for the slideout to miss the TV while going in and out. You wouldn't notice it unless told about it. This is not a modification for the faint of heart as it involves some permanent alterations that could potentially effect resale value of your motorhome.

If you would like to see the van conversion I did prior to purchasing the Solera, go here.
If you're into modifying things, there are a lot of ideas I worked into it for convenience and comfort.